Will our keepers cost us promotion?

[Eaststandman]

Don't think McCarthy covered himself in glory for palarse against the spuds at the weekend, goalies get beaten and make mistakes from time to time shocker!

[bcubed]

You can add to "costing us points", "costing us progress in cup competitions"

[RoyalBlue]

If you were to rank our current squad by ability and performances to date, our keepers would be very close to, if not at the bottom. That really isn't good enough for such a key, specialist position.

Don't think McCarthy covered himself in glory for palarse against the spuds at the weekend, goalies get beaten and make mistakes from time to time shocker!

Absolutely true but they usually more than make up for it with some excellent saves. Neither of our current two have done that yet. The percentage of shots on target that have resulted in goals is quite shocking. They are in debt and their overdraft is increasing substantially.

[royal_rumble]

If you were to rank our current squad by ability and performances to date, our keepers would be very close to, if not at the bottom. That really isn't good enough for such a key, specialist position.

Don't think McCarthy covered himself in glory for palarse against the spuds at the weekend, goalies get beaten and make mistakes from time to time shocker!

Absolutely true but they usually more than make up for it with some excellent saves. Neither of our current two have done that yet. The percentage of shots on target that have resulted in goals is quite shocking. They are in debt and their overdraft is increasing substantially.

Exactly that, Everton had 2 shots on target against us, and score 2. From memory I think Brentford was the same scenario.

Will certainly end up costing us points down the line.

[Sutekh]

I must admit I do not understand the logic of not buying an experienced keeper in the summer and trusting to a promising youngster. SC must have great faith in what Bond can do but that will not be shared by us until we can see what he can do - but then that means having a leakier defence in front of him.....

Trouble is as well he's not going to have any pressure on him from Al-Whoopsie...

As Mick Gooding keeps saying, hoping Bond can play a real blinder soon just give everyone a shot of confidence in that department.

[Norfolk Royal]

To be fair we did try and buy that other bloke who I can't remember his name from Swindon but he went somewhere else. That's not very good of course but the problem was recognised, just not acted upon quickly enough.

[Schards#2]

If you were to rank our current squad by ability and performances to date, our keepers would be very close to, if not at the bottom. That really isn't good enough for such a key, specialist position.

Don't think McCarthy covered himself in glory for palarse against the spuds at the weekend, goalies get beaten and make mistakes from time to time shocker!

Absolutely true but they usually more than make up for it with some excellent saves. Neither of our current two have done that yet. The percentage of shots on target that have resulted in goals is quite shocking. They are in debt and their overdraft is increasing substantially.

Exactly that, Everton had 2 shots on target against us, and score 2. From memory I think Brentford was the same scenario.

Will certainly end up costing us points down the line.

Given that we won 3-1, I'd have to disagree

I think both keepers are below Championship standard but, of the two, I would play Al-Habsi as he deals with crosses better and there are more of those than direct shots. Poor teams just lumping balls into the box have a decent chance of scoring against Bond without having to create a shooting opportunity

[royal_rumble]

If you were to rank our current squad by ability and performances to date, our keepers would be very close to, if not at the bottom. That really isn't good enough for such a key, specialist position.



Given that we won 3-1, I'd have to disagree

I think both keepers are below Championship standard but, of the two, I would play Al-Habsi as he deals with crosses better and there are more of those than direct shots. Poor teams just lumping balls into the box have a decent chance of scoring against Bond without having to create a shooting opportunity

The scenario being that every shot that they had on target went in, i.e. 1

[tidus_mi2]

So I looked over the match stats and got these figures for goals conceded for shots on target:

Bond 14 shots, 6 conceded, 43% scoring rate.
Al Habsi 9 shots, 3 conceded, 33% scoring rate.
Reading team 54 shots, 16 scored, 30% scoring rate.

It's difficult to really say who is more reliable as Al Habsi has only had 3 matches, 2 against lower league opposition but it doesn't speak well of Bond who is almost at a 50% rate of conceding shots on target.

[Vision]

So I looked over the match stats and got these figures for goals conceded for shots on target:

Bond 14 shots, 6 conceded, 43% scoring rate.
Al Habsi 9 shots, 3 conceded, 33% scoring rate.
Reading team 54 shots, 16 scored, 30% scoring rate.

It's difficult to really say who is more reliable as Al Habsi has only had 3 matches, 2 against lower league opposition but it doesn't speak well of Bond who is almost at a 50% rate of conceding shots on target.

Although another way of looking at is that he's only conceded 6 goals in 8 games and only one of those could be considered a howler. If he keeps that same ratio up then I would hazard a guess it's not quite the problem some are making out.

Of course how you view it may depend on how much you credit Bond with the organisation of a defence that has conceded so few shots on target and has a goals conceded record bettered only by the Top 2 at present.

[Maguire]

it doesn't speak well of Bond who is almost at a 50% rate of conceding shots on target.

It's not "almost 50%", it's 43%. You made the calculation and got a figure so use it rather than making something up.

Secondly, it's meaningless given these shots are all completely different and not some repeatable effort. Nobody would have saved Birmingham's deflected free-kick. The Brentford goal was a stunner right against the inside of the post. The Wednesday shot was unstoppable (sure, his drop led to the easy chance but that's a different argument). The Ipswich goal was unstoppable given it was tapped in from six yards.

So what are we saying, that he might have saved Ince's goal for Derby? I think I can live with that.
.

[Maguire]

Poor teams just lumping balls into the box have a decent chance of scoring against Bond without having to create a shooting opportunity

Given this has only happened once all season I'd say they don't have a decent chance of scoring by just lumping it into the area.

[savage 4 england]

Not sure I could watch a play-off final with either in goal.

[maffff]

I hope Myhill is available come January

Don't think 43% as 'nearly 50%' sis too disingenuous given the context. Small sample though.

[RoyalBlue]

Federici had some howlers, granted, and Bond may well end up with no more than him, however, what Bond hasn't shown yet which Federici did was is that 'oooh' save that looked a certain goal. For all of Federici's flaps he also provided us with some absolutely sublime moments that we've yet to see from the young Englishman.

I was a Federici fan, but a lot of his 'worldie' saves were nothing of the sort, Feds liked a save for cameras.

Bond is only 22 years old and generally looks composed and steady. He has had a couple of 'moments', but certainly looks like being a top keeper in the future. Certainly as good a prospect as McCarthy was at a similar age. And Bond can kick the ball too, which is handy.

Sorry, but I don't agree . Feds wasn't more of a 'camera save' person than most keepers. Far too many neutrals, including a lot of experienced players, managers, pundits etc. talked of the excellence of his saves on too frequent a basis for there not to be some substance behind that assessment.

As for Bond being able to kick a ball? Clarke announced to the world that he was weak in that area and had instructed his players not to pass to him on his left foot. You definitely have a weak spot in your team when your players have to take time to consider whether they can pass the ball to their keeper, not because he is under pressure from the opposition, but because he is not comfortable with the ball at his feet.

[Sanguine]

Federici had some howlers, granted, and Bond may well end up with no more than him, however, what Bond hasn't shown yet which Federici did was is that 'oooh' save that looked a certain goal. For all of Federici's flaps he also provided us with some absolutely sublime moments that we've yet to see from the young Englishman.

I was a Federici fan, but a lot of his 'worldie' saves were nothing of the sort, Feds liked a save for cameras.

Bond is only 22 years old and generally looks composed and steady. He has had a couple of 'moments', but certainly looks like being a top keeper in the future. Certainly as good a prospect as McCarthy was at a similar age. And Bond can kick the ball too, which is handy.

Sorry, but I don't agree . Feds wasn't more of a 'camera save' person than most keepers. Far too many neutrals, including a lot of experienced players, managers, pundits etc. talked of the excellence of his saves on too frequent a basis for there not to be some substance behind that assessment.

As for Bond being able to kick a ball? Clarke announced to the world that he was weak in that area and had instructed his players not to pass to him on his left foot. You definitely have a weak spot in your team when your players have to take time to consider whether they can pass the ball to their keeper, not because he is under pressure from the opposition, but because he is not comfortable with the ball at his feet.

Was just my viewpoint, perhaps he was better against Derby, and I've only seen him live twice, but he didn't look particularly worrying.

[PistolPete]

Let's be honest, Al Habsi isn't a laughing stock without reason. Ask the whole of the Championship which keeper is a liability and I'd guess 80%+ would single out Al-Habsi. Why are we looking at stats (interesting as they are)?

With regards Bond...Watford fans knew they were selling a keeper with potential, but a long way to go. The big question is, can we afford to carry him while he learns?

Debatably last season we carried the learning processes of Hector, Obita and Blackman which was fine because once we knew we'd neither get relegated or promoted there was no reason why not to. The question is, can we afford to carry Bond's learning process this season? If the answer is no, then we really ought to get another keeper in in January or now on loan, if we can afford to then we may have a great keeeper on our books next season and beyond as a result.

My opinion? He's doing ok for now, jury definitely out though...

[Ian Royal]

Bond's a good punt, but he doesn't inspire confidence. With a young keeper like that you really need an older more experienced and reliable keeper backing him up. Al-Habsi is anything but. On the other hand Al-Habsi was free and probably not our first choice.

We'll survive. Neither are bad enough to make a huge difference to our season. We've got enough in the rest of the team that if it fully clicks the odd howler and soft goal won't be disastrous. If we don't click we won't near enough promotion anyway.

[West Stand Man]

Not sure I could watch a play-off final with either in goal.

Well that is one less person for me to have to compete with for my seat then.

More seriously, I have watched both keepers this season and I can't get the high levels of negativity. All players make errors and these 2 are no different. Would I prefer us to have De Gea in goal? Probably, but I don't se these 2 as any worse than most other Championship keepers.

[RoyalBlue]

Not sure I could watch a play-off final with either in goal.

Well that is one less person for me to have to compete with for my seat then.

More seriously, I have watched both keepers this season and I can't get the high levels of negativity. All players make errors and these 2 are no different. Would I prefer us to have De Gea in goal? Probably, but I don't se these 2 as any worse than most other Championship keepers.

Blimey, just how carefully have you watched them? To date they have made more errors and less saves than most. Even if they weren't any worse than most other Championship keepers - and that is an absolutely massive if- you actually want keepers that are better than most others in their league. That has certainly been the case on each occasion when we have been promoted in my memory.

Bond's a good punt, but he doesn't inspire confidence. With a young keeper like that you really need an older more experienced and reliable keeper backing him up. Al-Habsi is anything but. On the other hand Al-Habsi was free and probably not our first choice.

We'll survive. Neither are bad enough to make a huge difference to our season. We've got enough in the rest of the team that if it fully clicks the odd howler and soft goal won't be disastrous. If we don't click we won't near enough promotion anyway.

How many points do they have to gift away and fail to save for us before they make a huge difference to our season? To date Bond has given some away and has yet to be acknowledged as saving any for us.

As for Al-Habsi - on everything I've seen from him whilst he has been with us and played for our opponents, he will definitely cost us more points than he saves.