England Friendlies

[Hoop Blah]

You don't need a pro licence to be a coach though so that £7k is a bit misleading.

no you're right, sorry but i meant that most people would be put off to start if they were only going to stop half way....give them an incentive to become a first team coach/manager of a club but then use them to coach the kids along the way (ie, we will pay for your pro-licence if you coach the kids for X years)

At what level though?

Caoching isn't the same as being a manager and 99% of people who do their coaching badges won't have intentions to make it as a professional manager.

I read somewhere that only something like 20% of those that do Level 1 go on to do their Level 2 (I think that's probably because Level 1 appears to be so poor).

I'm sure there are lots of clubs and organisations that pay for their staff/members to go through the different levels of coaching just like in any other industry. Pretty sure you're own youth club (Saints) pay for their coaches courses don't they?

[TBM]

You don't need a pro licence to be a coach though so that £7k is a bit misleading.

no you're right, sorry but i meant that most people would be put off to start if they were only going to stop half way....give them an incentive to become a first team coach/manager of a club but then use them to coach the kids along the way (ie, we will pay for your pro-licence if you coach the kids for X years)

At what level though?

Caoching isn't the same as being a manager and 99% of people who do their coaching badges won't have intentions to make it as a professional manager.

I read somewhere that only something like 20% of those that do Level 1 go on to do their Level 2 (I think that's probably because Level 1 appears to be so poor).

I'm sure there are lots of clubs and organisations that pay for their staff/members to go through the different levels of coaching just like in any other industry. Pretty sure you're own youth club (Saints) pay for their coaches courses don't they?

Yes they do and i will be starting next year as i want to start coaching the kids....

What i basically meant was that the FA should set up more academy's (with a direction on how the England team of the future will play) for the youth and then fund the coaches all the way through.....which includes that incentive that if they wanted to take it further into management or first team coach they would have the backing of the FA.

Thats really poor that only 20% go on to L2 - thats where they need to start then, make L1 better and the interest will soon pick up.

[LWJ]

What age TBM you would scare them with your shaved look

[TBM]

What age TBM you would scare them with your shaved look

6/7 year olds

[Hoop Blah]

What i basically meant was that the FA should set up more academy's (with a direction on how the England team of the future will play) for the youth and then fund the coaches all the way through.....which includes that incentive that if they wanted to take it further into management or first team coach they would have the backing of the FA.

I get ya. It's a nice idea but not sure it would ever lead to an improvement at the top of the game.

As soon as a kid looks half decent he's going be taken on by a club and then his coaching is going to led by them. I don't think that's any different throughout Europe, but I might be wrong.

The FA need to do all they can to make sure than the coaching at all levels is suitable for developing kids and keeping the game popular. I think they're doing ok at that although the numbers don't quite support that. I'm sure there is lots they could do better though.

Thats really poor that only 20% go on to L2 - thats where they need to start then, make L1 better and the interest will soon pick up.

Agreed. I think the level 1 is a really tin pot dummies guide to football and probably not necessary for anybody with any experience of playing organised football. If you look at the course syllabus it's pretty basic, so much so that you don't need to do Level 1 to do Level 2.

[TBM]

As soon as a kid looks half decent he's going be taken on by a club and then his coaching is going to led by them. I don't think that's any different throughout Europe, but I might be wrong.

This is where we need to follow the Spain/Barca model - where by the Spanish FA and Barcelona have an agreement in place that both sides will play the similar style of football, so Barca will train these youngsters up the "Spanish way". Or just restrict it so clubs cant sign players until a certain age - which by that time they have grown up knowing the "english way"

Another aspect is the limit of foreign players in the premier league......we kind of have it in place at the moment but restrict it more so more English players are given a chance of first team football.

There has to be a reason why Spain are producing these gifted players and we are not!?

[6ft Kerplunk]

What age TBM you would scare them with your shaved look

Don't think he's going to be showering with them.

[TBM]

What age TBM you would scare them with your shaved look

Don't think he's going to be showering with them.

ALOL

[Hoop Blah]

This is where we need to follow the Spain/Barca model - where by the Spanish FA and Barcelona have an agreement in place that both sides will play the similar style of football, so Barca will train these youngsters up the "Spanish way". Or just restrict it so clubs cant sign players until a certain age - which by that time they have grown up knowing the "english way"

Is that really true though? I've never heard anything about it. Isn't it more than Barca are following the model implemented by Cruyf and enhanced over the years and then the national team have adopted the same style to make the best use of the talents Barca, Real and the rest of the clubs produce.

There has to be a reason why Spain are producing these gifted players and we are not!?

I think it's quite a cyclical thing. Not so long ago everyone was raving about the French system and how it must be best. They've failed to develop another batch of players who are as good as the previous generation despite having the same systems in place.

It's also worth keeping in mind that success breeds success and that a couple of exceptional players can make a side click and some players look better than they are (see Zidane, Thuram and Viera for France and Xavi and Iniesta for Spain).

[TBM]

This is where we need to follow the Spain/Barca model - where by the Spanish FA and Barcelona have an agreement in place that both sides will play the similar style of football, so Barca will train these youngsters up the "Spanish way". Or just restrict it so clubs cant sign players until a certain age - which by that time they have grown up knowing the "english way"

Is that really true though? I've never heard anything about it. Isn't it more than Barca are following the model implemented by Cruyf and enhanced over the years and then the national team have adopted the same style to make the best use of the talents Barca, Real and the rest of the clubs produce.

Yes, Barca have a set style of play/formation and buy players to fit the formation not shift the formation to fit the player(s)....so the Spanish FA thought it would be a good idea to keep the same with the national team - as you say to make use of Barcas talent. So they have agreed to keep the same style as each other.

The only problem i can see with this model is when a majority of the Spanish players at Barca get fcuked off having to play everything through Messi - something they don't do for the national team.

[Hoop Blah]

We basically have that same thing in England though don't we?

United generally play 4-4-2 with a couple of wingers and the majority of the Premier League play the same way (4-5-1 coming more into fashion recently of course, unless your name is Capello!). The obvious (important) exceptions over the last 5 or so years being Chelsea, Liverpool and Arsenal who each adopted different approaches depending on the manager and/or players available.

In Spain the other clubs don't all play the same as Barca and it didn't stop the likes of Alonso, Ramos, Torres or Villa (before signing for Barca) being key players in Spains success.

We do need clubs (and the FA under your suggestion) to turn out players with more technical and tactical ability though, totally agree with you there, my only different take on it is that we are already moving that way but we're just some way off it really bearing fruit.

[TBM]

We basically have that same thing in England though don't we?

United generally play 4-4-2 with a couple of wingers and the majority of the Premier League play the same way (4-5-1 coming more into fashion recently of course, unless your name is Capello!). The obvious (important) exceptions over the last 5 or so years being Chelsea, Liverpool and Arsenal who each adopted different approaches depending on the manager and/or players available.

In Spain the other clubs don't all play the same as Barca and it didn't stop the likes of Alonso, Ramos, Torres or Villa (before signing for Barca) being key players in Spains success.

We do need clubs (and the FA under your suggestion) to turn out players with more technical and tactical ability though, totally agree with you there, my only different take on it is that we are already moving that way but we're just some way off it really bearing fruit.

This is true but i think, from what i've read/heard, that Barca basically gave Spain a lesson on how to play football to win things - it may have taken them 10+ years to get there but they've got there. Maybe the coaching of these players (Villa, Torres etc) as a kid was spot on so by the time they had broken in to the team at At Madrid, Valencia etc they already had an understanding on how the national team will play.

For England though, its more than a formation that we need (going forward) - if we are to play the "Man Utd way" then fine, work with Utd and share knowledge/coaches push talented players their way etc. Then if more clubs in England wish to buy in to this then its only a good thing for England as a national side. The only problem is all the foreign owners, managers etc wont have an interest in producing quality English players - they just want the best XI available.

[Hoop Blah]

Totally agree on the last few bits.

I think it also comes down to the manager of the time getting the best out of the players he has and not just picking the names and shoehorning them in to an XI (Sven and McLaren I'm looking at you!).

[Bandini]

Premier League clubs in the UK outside the top 4 seem to have more money to go and buy foreign players ready for the team now than the Spanish sides outside of Barca & Real Madrid. Can't see that changing in the short term.

[TBM]

Premier League clubs in the UK outside the top 4 seem to have more money to go and buy foreign players ready for the team now than the Spanish sides outside of Barca & Real Madrid. Can't see that changing in the short term.

Unless you limit the amount of foreign players a team can pick?!

[cmonurz]

Anything that artificially makes Liverpool better again gets a yes in my book.

[Ian Royal]

Think our midfield really ought to include Parker & Wilshire. Wilshire can really pick a pass and is obviously the future and Parker is a really busy player who can tackle and will play the simple ball. Then there's room for the likes of Rooney / Gerrard / Lampard etc sitting in the hole behind a single striker linking up play and packing out midfield when necessary.

Milner's useful against the better teams to be able to pack midfield more and be a bit more solid wide left. While against lesser teams we can go with a more flying winger like Downing / Johnson / SWP etc. Someone with pace and skill on the right like Walcott / Lennon.

[cmonurz]

Hart, Walker, Cahill, Terry, Baines, Downing, Rodwell, Jones, Barry, Walcott, Zamora

The prospect of a team like this ^^ won't have encouraged people to go either.

Zamora, fcuking hell.

[thirtyyarder]

Quite lime the look of that team actually. Wouldve preferred Johnson to downing, but whatever.

[Ian Royal]

Nice to see we're trying to work it short. Shame we're failing to show good enough movement or passing as usual.