Rank these clubs

[Royal With Cheese]

There is no way on this entire planet that the aforementioned players are on 80k a week.

80K between them perhaps.

[FiNeRaIn]

This is a debate about fanbase not finances, QPR in the last 10 or so years have been substancially below Reading, thats all there really is to it.

[LoyalRoyalFan]

I read a book last year that analyses football support, and this is a lot less static in its make-up than many would think. It really breaks down into about

Each club has it's "core support" - people who go to every game. This number tends to change only gradually - up or down - over the years with success or failure, and is often based on family/upbringing etc, things that don't change easily. The surprising thing is that whilst this total number typically stays fairly static the actual people change each year by about 5-10%. People die, go to uni, get married etc, and new supporters come along each year.

Then there is transient support - people who come along when a club is going well or for certain games only - they have an "allegiance" to the club but aren't hard-core supporters.

Then there are just spectators - people who enjoy going to watch football but don't support either team playing. They just might not support a team at all or might support another team they can't get to, or might go along with a supporter. Surprisingly, this figure is usually a minimum of 10% or so of any crowd.

So there are all sorts of factors at play - making the whole question much more complex than it seems at first sight.

What is the name of the book?

[Svlad Cjelli]

I read a book last year that analyses football support, and this is a lot less static in its make-up than many would think. It really breaks down into about

Each club has it's "core support" - people who go to every game. This number tends to change only gradually - up or down - over the years with success or failure, and is often based on family/upbringing etc, things that don't change easily. The surprising thing is that whilst this total number typically stays fairly static the actual people change each year by about 5-10%. People die, go to uni, get married etc, and new supporters come along each year.

Then there is transient support - people who come along when a club is going well or for certain games only - they have an "allegiance" to the club but aren't hard-core supporters.

Then there are just spectators - people who enjoy going to watch football but don't support either team playing. They just might not support a team at all or might support another team they can't get to, or might go along with a supporter. Surprisingly, this figure is usually a minimum of 10% or so of any crowd.

So there are all sorts of factors at play - making the whole question much more complex than it seems at first sight.

What is the name of the book?

[Tredder]

This is a debate about fanbase not finances, QPR in the last 10 or so years have been substancially below Reading, thats all there really is to it.

Excellent use of timescales, it's very much like the thread owner, he thinks Reading were formed in 1998.

[FiNeRaIn]

What relivence is a clubs past when the game is played in the present tredder? use your brain, you're smarter than that.

[Jackson Corner]

There is no way on this entire planet that the aforementioned players are on 80k a week.

That's what SWP was on at Man City why would he half his pay to play for them. Barton was on 60k a week at Newcastle one of the biggest mercenries in the modern game no way he would take a drop in wages.

[LoyalRoyalFan]

This is a debate about fanbase not finances, QPR in the last 10 or so years have been substancially below Reading, thats all there really is to it.

Excellent use of timescales, it's very much like the thread owner, he thinks Reading were formed in 1998.

All I said was to rank these clubs in order

[LoyalRoyalFan]

I read a book last year that analyses football support, and this is a lot less static in its make-up than many would think. It really breaks down into about

Each club has it's "core support" - people who go to every game. This number tends to change only gradually - up or down - over the years with success or failure, and is often based on family/upbringing etc, things that don't change easily. The surprising thing is that whilst this total number typically stays fairly static the actual people change each year by about 5-10%. People die, go to uni, get married etc, and new supporters come along each year.

Then there is transient support - people who come along when a club is going well or for certain games only - they have an "allegiance" to the club but aren't hard-core supporters.

Then there are just spectators - people who enjoy going to watch football but don't support either team playing. They just might not support a team at all or might support another team they can't get to, or might go along with a supporter. Surprisingly, this figure is usually a minimum of 10% or so of any crowd.

So there are all sorts of factors at play - making the whole question much more complex than it seems at first sight.

What is the name of the book?

Any good?

[Svlad Cjelli]

All I said was to rank these clubs in order

Definitely worth a read - some of the conclusions made were things I fundamentally disagreed with, but some of it makes good sense and just about all of it makes you think.

[Tredder]

What relivence is a clubs past when the game is played in the present tredder? use your brain, you're smarter than that.

QPR in the last 10 or so years have been substancially below Reading, thats all there really is to it

As stated, as of today, which i guess is present.

QPR 88%
Reading 75%

[FiNeRaIn]

88% what?

whats the average attendances?

[Rev Algenon Stickleback H]

Then there are just spectators - people who enjoy going to watch football but don't support either team playing. They just might not support a team at all or might support another team they can't get to, or might go along with a supporter. Surprisingly, this figure is usually a minimum of 10% or so of any crowd.

It's be interesting to see how that 10% stat was arrived at. I mean, that would mean 7500 people at Old Trafford each game don't support either team. I find the likelihood of that being true to be miniscule.

Even lower down the scale, I can't really believe that 500 people go to every Oxford game without supporting either side.

You might get that in non-league football with groundhoppers etc, or the exiled fan who takes in the odd game at his new local club, but I've never met anyone who regularly goes to league matches of teams he has no interest in.

[Tredder]

88% what?

whats the average attendances?

It's not relevant, probably about as relevant as citing the last 10 years.

[FiNeRaIn]

It is relivent, if not then reading = bigger than leeds/barcelona by your logic.

[Svlad Cjelli]

Then there are just spectators - people who enjoy going to watch football but don't support either team playing. They just might not support a team at all or might support another team they can't get to, or might go along with a supporter. Surprisingly, this figure is usually a minimum of 10% or so of any crowd.

It's be interesting to see how that 10% stat was arrived at. I mean, that would mean 7500 people at Old Trafford each game don't support either team. I find the likelihood of that being true to be miniscule.

Even lower down the scale, I can't really believe that 500 people go to every Oxford game without supporting either side.

You might get that in non-league football with groundhoppers etc, or the exiled fan who takes in the odd game at his new local club, but I've never met anyone who regularly goes to league matches of teams he has no interest in.

Certainly, the lower down the pyramid the higher the percentage of the crowd is "hard core" - but at any match think of all the mates, wives, kids and girlfriends who don't support the team and would never go to a game on their own but who are only at that game because they're there with someone. Then add in neutrals that "just go to a game" but support another team that they can't watch.

[Kitsondinho]

All I said was to rank these clubs in order

Definitely worth a read - some of the conclusions made were things I fundamentally disagreed with, but some of it makes good sense and just about all of it makes you think.

I have it too and agree with Svlad's above statement. At times the authors take their reasoning a bit too far.

[Rev Algenon Stickleback H]

Then there are just spectators - people who enjoy going to watch football but don't support either team playing. They just might not support a team at all or might support another team they can't get to, or might go along with a supporter. Surprisingly, this figure is usually a minimum of 10% or so of any crowd.

It's be interesting to see how that 10% stat was arrived at. I mean, that would mean 7500 people at Old Trafford each game don't support either team. I find the likelihood of that being true to be miniscule.

Even lower down the scale, I can't really believe that 500 people go to every Oxford game without supporting either side.

You might get that in non-league football with groundhoppers etc, or the exiled fan who takes in the odd game at his new local club, but I've never met anyone who regularly goes to league matches of teams he has no interest in.

Certainly, the lower down the pyramid the higher the percentage of the crowd is "hard core" - but at any match think of all the mates, wives, kids and girlfriends who don't support the team and would never go to a game on their own but who are only at that game because they're there with someone. Then add in neutrals that "just go to a game" but support another team that they can't watch.

It seems hard enough to get some keen Reading supporters to come to games these days. The odd big game aside, I can't really see 1500-2000 neutrals at every Reading match. For a 17500 crowd, with 11000 season ticket holders, and 1500 away fans typically at every game, it would mean 1750 of the remaining 5000 being neutrals. That's 35%, over a third, and that doesn't seem remotely realistic.


How was this 10% figure arrived at? Was it given in that detail, or was it just perhaps a suggestion that 10% of a crowd are neutrals?

[soggy biscuit]

Club size deb8's are massively gay. Still, I am with T-Redder on this one

[Tredder]

It is relivent, if not then reading = bigger than leeds/barcelona by your logic.

Yes, but behind QPR. lol lol etc (as that seems to help to get a point across)

When you see Bruce and Shiela, tell them i said hi. lol lol etc..