Valley Parade Fire - 1985

[No Fixed Abode]

Yep. I've actually got some pics of that somewhere. Remember Steve Cherry chatting with the Reading fans.

[larry1971]

The Southbank was wooden??? I thought it was all concrete with the caving in walls of the gents loo's, the Northstand I thought was the only wooden bit.

Steel supporting structure, but all of the floor and seating was wooden. Pretty standard design for any stand that had accommodation (bars/changing rooms etc) under it.

pretty sure the main stand at Southamptons old Dell ground was mainly wooden flooring and seats I think post Bradford the only thing that stopped these stands being closed was that unlike at Bradford these stands did not have a wooden structure - I can remember at Wokingham Town's old ground between the two railway tracks they had a small wooden stand that was still being used a good few years after the Bradford fire.

[Ian Royal]

It was the grounds fault and the authorities

Hypocrisy is a lifestyle choice for you, isn't it.

That's just how smokers act - throwing down a lit cigarette without any care for anyone else. It's not the said persons fault the stand wasn't fire proof or the authorities didn't act quicker.

If they'd behaved respectfully to their fellow supporters by not smoking in the ground, or by making sure they put out their cigerette properly, whether the ground was properly maintained or not wouldn't have made any difference. So it's clearly the smoker's fault.

That's basically identical to your Hillsborough argument.

[No Fixed Abode]

I was being ironic. Of course it was the smokers fault.

[Ian Royal]

Now the Hillsborough inquest has been completed, would it be worthwhile the FA looking at the 1985 Bradford Fire (research it on YouTube if you dont know or are too young), which was one of the worst things I've ever seen. Who is the culprit for this? The police did all they could and actually helped (should of been a warning for Hillsborough and a guideline of how to handle these things). Was it Bradford City, whose ground was unsafe by all measures (understand there was 100 year old litter under that stand)? Then again they were building a new stand to replace it. Or was it smoking on the terraces?

Anyhow there should now be a change of focus to the justice for those who died on that terrible afternoon.

Valley Parade was dealt with at the time and there was no attempt to pervert the cause of justice or blame the fans as far as I am aware so there is no purpose in trying to reopen it.

I had refresher firewarden training last week and by coincidence one of the videos we had to watch was of this fire. As I understand it, there was a potential negligence case against Bradford as the fire was caused by an unextinguished cigerette falling between the wooden planks of the stand and landing on decades of flammable refuse lying beneath it.

But back then health and safety recommendations didn't have to be implemented and there was a culture in the country of wait for a disaster and then legislate to prevent it recurring. This only really seems to have changed with legislation in 2006 where there's much more emphasis on predicting what could go wrong and preventing that from happening.

It really is horrifc viewing, but well worth watching to give people an appreciation of how dangerous fire is and how quickly it spreads.

I have no idea how you predict rare occurances and prevent them from happening.

Well, as an example, by considering what the consequences of building a stand out of wood and not clearing out debris from under it regularly, whilst allowing people to smoke whilst sitting in it.

And by showing you have a clear risk assessment and health and safety reviews for everything you do that might have a potentially hazardous occurrence, to show you have considered dangers in a responsible manner and tried to reduce the risks of them.

[Ian Royal]

I was being ironic. Of course it was the smokers fault.

How do you function as a human being whilst being that stupid?

[No Fixed Abode]

I was being ironic. Of course it was the smokers fault.

How do you function as a human being whilst being that stupid?

Did he or did he not play a part in the fire?

[Ian Royal]

I was being ironic. Of course it was the smokers fault.

How do you function as a human being whilst being that stupid?

Did he or did he not play a part in the fire?

trigger =/= cause.

[No Fixed Abode]

well, he was certainly partly to blame.

[TBM]

Didn't go to Elm Park until 1997

[Rev Algenon Stickleback H]

The Southbank was wooden??? I thought it was all concrete with the caving in walls of the gents loo's, the Northstand I thought was the only wooden bit.

Steel supporting structure, but all of the floor and seating was wooden. Pretty standard design for any stand that had accommodation (bars/changing rooms etc) under it.

I think some misunderstanding there. The North Stand was mainly wooden, but the southbank clearly wasn't.

In any case, it wasn't being wooden that made Bradford such a killer. It was because the roof was a tar covered fabric that was highly flammable. That sent the flames down the length of the stand in about 30 seconds.

The accumulated rubbish was also a large factor, but people didn't really give it a thought for some reason, until it ignited.

Another factor was that the turnstiles were all locked up, so people trying to escape out of the back of the stand were trapped.


In reality, the safety officials were probably a bit too hasty in condemning wooden stands across the country. Then again it depended on the local council, I believe, and how they assessed the risk. I was quite surprised to go to Old Trafford in 1990(ish) and find the terracing there was wooden, in the corner between the Stretford End and the main stand.


The fire at Reading was just some guy's pipe burning in his jacket. It was just smouldering, and luckily didn't actually catch fire.

[Ark Royal]

If this had happened in the Norfolk Road stand at Elm Park in 85, I do not think the death toll would have been anywhere as high. Smaller stand, with open access to the pitch from the front, would have made it a lot easier to get out. At Valley Parade, they had to deal with a paddock below the seats and a wall before getting on to the pitch.



(I hope and pray that everyone in that pic made it out alive)

[paultheroyal]

A lot of old folk died that day. Remember it clearly.

[Ark Royal]

The reason so many old people perished was that they were either caught at the top of the stand behind locked gates or were unfortunately too old to negotiate the paddock and the wall at the front and basically died in their seats. The speed at which the fire engulfed the entire structure still shocks me.

[AthleticoSpizz]

Eerily, from the top of my head and iirc, you could hear the Lincoln City (?) supporters singing thier derision in the background on the footage that was released back in the day. Guess the full and grim extent of what was actually going on at the time wasn't realised by them.

[John Madejski's Wallet]

My work shows the video of the fire every year in the Fire Safety training.

It is proper just how quickly it spreads (the video has a timer clock in the corner)

[Jerry St Clair]

Eerily, from the top of my head and iirc, you could hear the Lincoln City (?) supporters singing thier derision in the background on the footage that was released back in the day. Guess the full and grim extent of what was actually going on at the time wasn't realised by them.

I think it was home fans. There were very few away fans in attendance (although two Lincoln fans died in the fire).

[AthleticoSpizz]

Eerily, from the top of my head and iirc, you could hear the Lincoln City (?) supporters singing thier derision in the background on the footage that was released back in the day. Guess the full and grim extent of what was actually going on at the time wasn't realised by them.

I think it was home fans. There were very few away fans in attendance (although two Lincoln fans died in the fire).

^ no arguement from me there...as I say...its all from memory.....sadly tho' another "I remember where I was when it happened" moment

[Maguire]

That Notts County evac was quitye amusing - County fans on the pitch and the SB singing at one fat dude dressed in pink in particular, and him giving it a bit back.

Unfortunate footnote was that the delay caused the players tighten up a bit and Archie pulled a hamstring after the restart.

2-0 IIRC - Hartenburger with an ridiculous dummy when one on one.

[Ark Royal]

Could so easily have been Reading fans. They won 5-2 at Valley Parade the week before.