St. George's Park

[Jackson Corner]

You can have all the hydro pools, dietitions, Physios, medical science you want. It means jack shit when we can't produce players can keep the ball.

And how do you address that last point? Invest in a way of improving standards perhaps?

My honest opinion of someone who has watched England for 4 decades, is we are so far behind we have reached a point we will never catch up. We have a club culture in this country were no one gives a toss about the national team.

People would rather see there team of foriegners win the Champions league or the prem rather than the national team win the World cup. Until that attitude changes we willl always struggle.

[Jackson Corner]

Where were you when we were shit?

Sadly watching England.

[Hoop Blah]

My honest opinion of someone who has watched England for 4 decades, is we are so far behind we have reached a point we will never catch up. We have a club culture in this country were no one gives a toss about the national team.

People would rather see there team of foriegners win the Champions league or the prem rather than the national team win the World cup. Until that attitude changes we willl always struggle.

I agree there are cultural reasons why our national team are hampered (to a degree) but I really don't think we're that far behind.

The players our system produces aren't, at the top level, far behind the rest of Europe and I don't see any reason to be as defeatist as you're post suggests, and we are already seeing more technical players coming through in comparison to say 20 years ago. The volume isn't quite there perhaps, but there certainly seems to be a difference in type of player we produce now than in previous generations.

Spain and France have both been appalling at times in recent history but have turned their fortunes around. I don't see why we can't do the same to move us from plucky outsiders with a slight chance (bearing in mind we consistently get good results at international level however poor they often feel) in to more serious contenders.

[Stuboo]

Seems to be a mix of opinions; some really positive about SGP and others really negative and saying it won't change a thing.

I think it is a step towards success as it should help to address:

-the shortage of coaches
-the quality of coaches
-the quality of players (as a result of the above)
-a change of mentality from a physical hoofball game to a technical game

I am also a big fan of the changes Sir Trevor Brooking is making to youth football, for example, smaller pitches, smaller sides and smaller goals. This should help develop more technical players too.

I think if our national team is to be successful we also need to:

-increase the number of British players in the Premier League by a quota system, e.g., Each team must have 4 British players on the park at all times
-have a winter break
-address the problem of our irresponsible and aggressive media, damaging our chances with negative stories before major tournaments

But, overall, I am very positive. I totally agree with people saying the FA has not been proactive in the past, but I think you've got to admire what they are trying to do here. We need to get behind it!

[Stuboo]

My honest opinion of someone who has watched England for 4 decades, is we are so far behind we have reached a point we will never catch up.

That is one of the most defeatist things I think I've ever read. It will take a bit of time, we all know that, but we absolutely can catch up and even surpass the rest. A journey of a 1000 miles starts with a single step and all that.

[creative_username_1]

Hang on aren't you ranked third in the world?

[Hoop Blah]

No, 5th now.

The point people seem to focus on isn't how we're consistently in and around the latter stages of tournaments and collecting good results along the way, but more the fact that we've not won anything for a long long time and don't, apparently, play the most attractive brand of football or dominate teams as much as other countries apparently do.

We're not half as bad as many will make out, but, by the same token we aren't as good, or have the depth of talent available to us as the likes of Brazil, Spain or Germany.

[creative_username_1]

No, 5th now.

The point people seem to focus on isn't how we're consistently in and around the latter stages of tournaments and collecting good results along the way, but more the fact that we've not won anything for a long long time and don't, apparently, play the most attractive brand of football or dominate teams as much as other countries apparently do.

We're not half as bad as many will make out, but, by the same token we aren't as good, or have the depth of talent available to us as the likes of Brazil, Spain or Germany.

Brazil has a population of 190 million and football is there primary game shouldn't be surprised that they produce depth

Germany has 20 million more than us

There always has to be a reason why nations achieved what they did it can never be down to randomly producing 11 decent players
within the same time frame. France where the example when they were winning everything, lets do what they do. Hang on, it's not
working anymore etc

[Hoop Blah]

Totally agree.

Each countries circumstance are slightly different and the resources, facilities and external factors effecting their success vary. We need to do what is right for our system to produce the best quality players and teams it can.

I happen to think the FA do a pretty decent job and we're not half as bad as people like to make out.

The expectations and boom/bust nature of the fans and media perception of the team really doesn't help us. The perception that everyone else is better than us really doesn't stand up when you look at their results and actually watch some of their games.

We can't expect to be better than the best the world can offer all the time, which is what it seems plenty of people expect.

[soggy biscuit]

I am fairly baffled at what results we can expect to see from this place

[From Despair To Where?]

28% of players in the PL are English.
74% of players in La Liga are Spanish

90% of the old first division in the 1970's where English. We failed to qaulify for every major championship. We were shit then we are shit now. Lets just accept we are SHIT.

Yet from 1977 to 1984 English clubs won 7 of 8 European Cups not to mention 4 UEFA Cups between 1973 and 1983, all done with teams who were almost entirely British born or who received their footballing apprenticeships in Britain.

Makes me think it's the FA rather than English football in general that is shit.

[Barry the bird boggler]

28% of players in the PL are English.
74% of players in La Liga are Spanish

90% of the old first division in the 1970's where English. We failed to qaulify for every major championship. We were shit then we are shit now. Lets just accept we are SHIT.

Difference is we were at least entertaining sh*t then and now we're just dull, uninteresting and full of overpaid prima donnas more interested in club honours.

[Barry the bird boggler]

28% of players in the PL are English.
74% of players in La Liga are Spanish

90% of the old first division in the 1970's where English. We failed to qaulify for every major championship. We were shit then we are shit now. Lets just accept we are SHIT.

Yet from 1977 to 1984 English clubs won 7 of 8 European Cups not to mention 4 UEFA Cups between 1973 and 1983, all done with teams who were almost entirely British born or who received their footballing apprenticeships in Britain.

Makes me think it's the FA rather than English football in general that is shit.

Definitely the FA at fault (just like today), greatest managers of that period being the likes of Bob Paisley and Brian Clough but the FA were more interested in those that were part of the old boys network and/or didn't rock the boat.

[Alexander Litvinenko]

Alternatively its partly due to a culture where managers are everything and coaches aren't very highly regarded - and especially if they come with "new-fangled foreign ideas"

In England we have too few coaches, the coaches we have are not of a high-enough quality, and many of their ideas are hopeless outdated.

Plus the "dad-coaches" in kids' football often do massive amounts of damage to kids' development.

[Hoop Blah]

I don't think you can blame the FA for the likes of Souness, Dalglish, Hansen, McGoven, Robertson, Wark, Muhren etc etc not being English.

The Dutch never won mutch when Ajax were the top team, the Spanish never did when Real Madrid were by far the best team.

International 'success' is very hard to come by I guess.

[Stuboo]

I'm hearing a lot of whinging and moaning, but few solutions. We all agree we are not where we want to be, but the question is, what do we do about it?

[Alexander Litvinenko]

I'm hearing a lot of whinging and moaning, but few solutions. We all agree we are not where we want to be, but the question is, what do we do about it?

Build a centre of excellence for players and coaches, and properly instigate professional coaching regimes at professional clubs.

Then wait 15 years.

[soggy biscuit]

I'm hearing a lot of whinging and moaning, but few solutions. We all agree we are not where we want to be, but the question is, what do we do about it?

Nothing at all. I don't see why we have to do anything about it.

[handbags_harris]

Plus the "dad-coaches" in kids' football often do massive amounts of damage to kids' development.

My little lad will play professional football in 17-20 years time. Just you watch

[Alexander Litvinenko]

Plus the "dad-coaches" in kids' football often do massive amounts of damage to kids' development.

My little lad will be sent off for foul and abusive language in 17-20 years time. Just you watch

Corrected for you.