How Long Will BM Last at this rate?????

[melonhead]

I caught a bit of McDermott on TalkSport this morning and he was saying how he was just 'enjoying being in the Premier League'. I heard Legiertwood saying something very similar on Radio Berks earlier in the week.

It made me think that perhaps there is a feeling in the club that we're just lucky to be where we are and just to go out and enjoy 38 big days out instead of really feeling at home and competitive. We've a few players in the squad who have been waiting years to get here and perhaps there's not the hunger of what seemed to be a younger squad last time we came up.

McDermott says the same old things over and over again lucky to be here, look how far we have come, fantastic bunch of lads, Ha i dont hear vibes from swansea comming out with all this properganda they just got on with it

he says it over and over again, because they are inherrantly true, and we also have a large number of fans who forget this. therefore it needs repeating.
& if you listend to every press release from them youd see the same shit coming out of their club. but you dont, you mainly look at stuff from our club

[melonhead]

McDermott says the same old things over and over again lucky to be here, look how far we have come, fantastic bunch of lads, Ha i dont hear vibes from swansea comming out with all this properganda they just got on with it and gave there fans something to be proud of never once have they faced the chop since they have been in the top flight but then again would any of our squad get in the side. look forward to tomorrow same old faces same old style of play same old excuses post match. we didnt deserve that , we should have had a penalty, could of gone either way, its not just going for us at the moment, never mind Utd after this one

Same old spoilt, moaning, fans who after 20 years of almost constant growth cry like little babies and call for the board/manager/tea lady to be sacked when something goes slightly wrong.

Lift your head out of the sand and you will see it is more then something going slightly wrong

[Hoop Blah]

of staying ahead of the likes of Sheff Utd, Sheff Weds, Birmingham etc etc who could claim to be bigger and better than us.

and are all teams you would expect us to be beating regularly.

That's exactly my point.

We've got ourselves into this position over the last 5 or so years. Before that we'd have seen games against them as big games against bigger clubs (less so United)

[RoyalBlue]

I see it as a long game really - no point throwing the toys out of the pram after one result or even one poor season, so long as the general trend is upward.

I don't think RFC have ever been so well-positioned to push on as a club, although clearly staying in the Premier League next season would be a great help.

If people are going to compare us to whichever similar club is currently enjoying the most success (in this case, Swansea) then of course we'll come out unfavourably. There are a lot of other similarly-sized clubs doing significantly worse.

Very well put, same way as the club are playing it. Relegation would be disappointing but if you go boom or bust there'll inevitably be a point where bust catches up in the end.

Examples being?

Some clubs have got pretty sick through their over-indulgence but they still haven't died!

"You know what the media are like, unless it's got six noughts on the end they don't even want to know. Three million pounds for a player? Four? It gets meaningless. We are getting enormous sums of money for being in the Premiership, but the majority goes into players' and agents' pockets. It's all wrong," he says. "Will it implode? I wish it would. Sooner or later we're going to have to spend some serious money if we want to remain in the Premiership. And I mean serious. I don't want to be around when that happens."

John Madjeski August 2007.

[DOYLERSAROYALER]

"You know what the media are like, unless it's got six noughts on the end they don't even want to know. Three million pounds for a player? Four? It gets meaningless. We are getting enormous sums of money for being in the Premiership, but the majority goes into players' and agents' pockets. It's all wrong," he says. "Will it implode? I wish it would. Sooner or later we're going to have to spend some serious money if we want to remain in the Premiership. And I mean serious. I don't want to be around when that happens."


Madejski says that but I bet he's not in the very short queue to decline the TV money package on offer from Sky & co....after all isn't that what fuels the exact thing that Madejski abhors???

[Divvy]

"You know what the media are like, unless it's got six noughts on the end they don't even want to know. Three million pounds for a player? Four? It gets meaningless. We are getting enormous sums of money for being in the Premiership, but the majority goes into players' and agents' pockets. It's all wrong," he says. "Will it implode? I wish it would. Sooner or later we're going to have to spend some serious money if we want to remain in the Premiership. And I mean serious. I don't want to be around when that happens."


Madejski says that but I bet he's not in the very short queue to decline the TV money package on offer from Sky & co....after all isn't that what fuels the exact thing that Madejski abhors???

Link to the quotes please? Cheers.

[RoyalBlue]

"You know what the media are like, unless it's got six noughts on the end they don't even want to know. Three million pounds for a player? Four? It gets meaningless. We are getting enormous sums of money for being in the Premiership, but the majority goes into players' and agents' pockets. It's all wrong," he says. "Will it implode? I wish it would. Sooner or later we're going to have to spend some serious money if we want to remain in the Premiership. And I mean serious. I don't want to be around when that happens."


Madejski says that but I bet he's not in the very short queue to decline the TV money package on offer from Sky & co....after all isn't that what fuels the exact thing that Madejski abhors???

Link to the quotes please? Cheers.

http://www.director.co.uk/magazine/2007/8%20aug/medejski_61_1.html





And on a different theme, contrast this squad with the squad we had the first time we got into the PL (and look at the playing style)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EG7ON0qy5XM

[Maguire]

I see it as a long game really - no point throwing the toys out of the pram after one result or even one poor season, so long as the general trend is upward.

I don't think RFC have ever been so well-positioned to push on as a club, although clearly staying in the Premier League next season would be a great help.

If people are going to compare us to whichever similar club is currently enjoying the most success (in this case, Swansea) then of course we'll come out unfavourably. There are a lot of other similarly-sized clubs doing significantly worse.

You directly asked the question about comparison with other clubs so some of us responded and Hoop Blah in particular offered up the likes of Fulham,Wigan and Norwich as well as Swansea so it was not just directed at one club only that is currently doing better than us..

No, somebody else brought up Swansea and referred to them as a one-off.

I didn't think the examples Hoop Blah gave as a rebuttal were very good to be honest. We patently do not have the same resources as QPR (take a look at that wage bill) and Southampton (6th biggest transfer spend in Europe last summer). Do you think Fulham are comparable? They've signed several 10+ million pound players. Wigan weren't doing better than us until last weekend, were they? And Norwich are a sinking ship. They've won once in the last ten games.

I'm not denying the need to progress, i'm not advocating pocketing the cash like Blackpool and taking a relegation on the chin, I just think people need to see this as a project that will last many years not just a few months.

[Victor Meldrew]

I see it as a long game really - no point throwing the toys out of the pram after one result or even one poor season, so long as the general trend is upward.

I don't think RFC have ever been so well-positioned to push on as a club, although clearly staying in the Premier League next season would be a great help.

If people are going to compare us to whichever similar club is currently enjoying the most success (in this case, Swansea) then of course we'll come out unfavourably. There are a lot of other similarly-sized clubs doing significantly worse.

You directly asked the question about comparison with other clubs so some of us responded and Hoop Blah in particular offered up the likes of Fulham,Wigan and Norwich as well as Swansea so it was not just directed at one club only that is currently doing better than us..

No, somebody else brought up Swansea and referred to them as a one-off.

I didn't think the examples Hoop Blah gave as a rebuttal were very good to be honest. We patently do not have the same resources as QPR (take a look at that wage bill) and Southampton (6th biggest transfer spend in Europe last summer). Do you think Fulham are comparable? They've signed several 10+ million pound players. Wigan weren't doing better than us until last weekend, were they? And Norwich are a sinking ship. They've won once in the last ten games.

I'm not denying the need to progress, i'm not advocating pocketing the cash like Blackpool and taking a relegation on the chin, I just think people need to see this as a project that will last many years not just a few months.

I think it will be interesting to re-visit this in say 5 years time to see whether our "project" has done better or worse than any other of those clubs' projects.
Don't believe for one minute that we are the only club with a "project" and despite what you say about those other clubs I doubt that they will just stand still and wait for us to catch them up and go past them.
BTW Norwich are still above us and Fulham and Wigan have sold players for loads of money over the years and yet have survived probably through good management of resources such as not being prepared to pay a Russian £65,000 per week but preferring to bring in one of the best strikers that the Premier League has seen in the last 10 years.

[Divvy]

Look at that back 6..

[Once were Biscuitmen]

Fulham, QPR, Wigan and Southampton are all effectively subsidized by charitable foundations.

They don't have to attempt to live in the real world or even break even in the medium term.

We don't have that luxury despite a owner who has invested in the team. They are playing strategies that we just don't have the option of without accumulating risky levels of debt.

Hopefully FFP will come in over time (despite our ironic half hearted approach to it as a club).

[Ian Royal]

Look at that back 6..

The frightening thing is that with only a few minutes work you can show something a little closer to how it should have looked. (I think I could see who was who correctly... )

[Maguire]

Don't believe for one minute that we are the only club with a "project" and despite what you say about those other clubs I doubt that they will just stand still and wait for us to catch them up and go past them

Of course they won't "stand still and wait for us to catch them up". You just have to have faith that the project plan, if you will, is set-up for longer term success than lashing millions of pounds at Chris Samba or Loic Remy.

BTW Norwich are still above us and Fulham and Wigan have sold players for loads of money over the years and yet have survived probably through good management of resources such as not being prepared to pay a Russian £65,000 per week but preferring to bring in one of the best strikers that the Premier League has seen in the last 10 years.

1) Pogrebnyak isn't on 65k a week

2) How much do you think Berbatov earns?! He was on over 100k a week at Man Utd

[Hoop Blah]

No, somebody else brought up Swansea and referred to them as a one-off.

I didn't think the examples Hoop Blah gave as a rebuttal were very good to be honest. We patently do not have the same resources as QPR (take a look at that wage bill) and Southampton (6th biggest transfer spend in Europe last summer). Do you think Fulham are comparable? They've signed several 10+ million pound players. Wigan weren't doing better than us until last weekend, were they? And Norwich are a sinking ship. They've won once in the last ten games.

I'm not denying the need to progress, i'm not advocating pocketing the cash like Blackpool and taking a relegation on the chin, I just think people need to see this as a project that will last many years not just a few months.

My examples were of clubs who had made the most of their respective chances to kick on. In a way they've made the jump better than others who also had the same chances.

Yes they have, either gradually or in a short space of time, spent money in varying degrees (Wigan haven't, QPRs spending is more a recent thing this season after getting here, Stoke have gradually built up and invested reasonably sensibly and Fulham are, in their Premier years probably relatively frugal and sensible) to try and stay here but don't think that some of those other medium sized clubs haven't spent lots in comparison (Birmingham, Wolves and Villa have spent lots in their attempts to be better than West Brom and Fulham).

We also shouldn't undervalue the extent that we have been bankrolled in similar fashion to those clubs over the last 20 years. We might not have splashed the cash quite as dramatically but apart from a couple of seasons we've been living well beyond our means as well.

Either way, our potential to compete at this level is clear. We can put a decent 15 or 16 players together to compete at this level. We haven't this season for a multitude of reasons and its not just because we haven't spent another £10/20/30m on the squad.

[The Quiet Man]

My examples were of clubs who had made the most of their respective chances to kick on. In a way they've made the jump better than others who also had the same chances.

Yes they have, either gradually or in a short space of time, spent money in varying degrees (Wigan haven't, QPRs spending is more a recent thing this season after getting here, Stoke have gradually built up and invested reasonably sensibly and Fulham are, in their Premier years probably relatively frugal and sensible) to try and stay here but don't think that some of those other medium sized clubs haven't spent lots in comparison (Birmingham, Wolves and Villa have spent lots in their attempts to be better than West Brom and Fulham).

Would point out that nearly all those teams had a least one season where the chairman ponied up a significant amount of money. Wigan's chairman gave his manager £20M on promotion as he did not want to go in his words go straight back down. Every other team mentioned had a similar season or seasons (Stoke spent upwards of £20M 2 seasons ago. Fulham spent absoutely shitloads when they went up).

The only team that didn't spend a huge amount were Swansea who could had the contacts/scouting to get key players from abroad as they could never have afforded the domestic equivalents. They would probaly be the nearest equivalents to RFC. SJM would not bankroll a big spend the first time we were up (he was prepared for maybe one big signing but wages were much more significant in who we could afford and who would be likely to join).

As for this season I don't think the equivalent finances were in place at the start of the season for us to really splash the cash, the indications were that that was not the case in January but there was very little value to be had and very few prepared (or allowed) to move without involving very silly sums of money. That has been two very average transfer seasos that will cost us more in the longer run.

What worries me is that under McD the team has gone backwards this season and our "key players" are championship journeymen in Mcanuff & Legs who should have been replaced at the start of the season and that reliance was placed on Gorkss and Gunter who were never prem defenders. The team now needs 4 or 5 key signings next season whichever division it is in and that is I feel a job that is beyond McD.

[Divvy]

What the f**k does Brian train this lot?

Our passing is always so heavy. It's quick and urgent and often leads to us making a mistake. McAnuff giving the ball away twice when he was running with it FFS!

Villa pass it with some patience, create space, and take their chances. We look well out of our depth and will rightfully end up bottom of the league this season!

You have to, and I'm sorry to say it, look at the manager. He's the one that together with Gibbs trains these players to play the way he wants. The buck stops with him!! I just want the season to end now and hope, though don't expect, a change of manager and someone with new ideas to come in, even if it does mean a season or two to build a new squad and get us back up. This is utter dogshit from McDermott! Fuming!!!!!!

[Big Ern]

other than a miracle, another hone defeat against a relegation rival. Man Utd and Arsenal away next, Sorry Brian, times up, do the club a favour and resign.

[Royal Lady]

other than a miracle, another hone defeat against a relegation rival. Man Utd and Arsenal away next, Sorry Brian, times up, do the club a favour and resign.

It's too late now. Who would come in?

[ManchesterRoyals]

other than a miracle, another hone defeat against a relegation rival. Man Utd and Arsenal away next, Sorry Brian, times up, do the club a favour and resign.

It's too late now. Who would come in?

Paolo Di Canio least he doesn't sugar coat things

[Royal Lady]

He's a racist mental head - no thanks.