BRAZIL football corruption chaos

[Millsy]

forgive me if this has been discussed before (i cant find it on GF) or if it doesnt make sense . its fri night and ive been out amd about and there may be substances/tiredness talking on my behalf here

on the drove home i heard in the radio a bizarre situation in brazil which goes something like this:

a team portugesa were mathematically safe from relegation so the last game was effectively a meaningless friendly
for the last 15min of that game they brought on a young player who apparently was suspended
however that ruling was only made the night before the game and websites werent updated in time or something so the team werent to know
portugesa were docked 4 points in punishment meaning they got relegated even though theyd have not benefoted at all from the offence and wouldve have had no motive really to cheat
as it happens the benefitting team, fluminese are a rich powerful team in brazilian football
theyve also escaped relegation once before on dodgy grounds i.e. once there was an issue with a ref so no teams got relegated that year and fluminese wouldve been one of them
and another time they were in div 3 but for some reason when they won promotion were allowed to bypass div 2 and go straight up to div 1 !!

sounded very interesting to my tired head at the time, but it seems pretty dodgy/corrupt to me

lol @ brazil

[From Despair To Where?]

That's Brazil for you.

Thread title should read "Brazil corruption normality".

[Millsy]

Ah. I guessed Brazil generally was a bit corrupt and crap but this is very surprising

[From Despair To Where?]

Something like that happens every time one of the big clubs gets in a spot of bother relegation wise.

Wouldn't surprise me if Portugesa where thrown a big brown envelope stuffed full of used notes to take a fall.

Despite the boom in the Brazilian economy, there's not a huge amount of money in Brazilian football outside the big clubs and even then they get help from private backers to pay the wages of the likes of Ronaldinho. It's financial murkiness like that which allows the likes of Kia Joorabchian to made money out of owning Carlos Tevez's registration and hawking him to the highest bidder.

[soggy biscuit]

Brazilian 2nd division doesn't always take place though, read reports that they have had to cancel it at times as they have problems with it. What's right by one countries standards is not always right by anothers. doesn't make it wrong though.

[From Despair To Where?]

I would imagine the smaller, provincial clubs have more interest in the State Championship because it gives them a chance to rub shoulders with the bigger teams. Not sure a team from Rio or Sao Paulo would really look forward to hauling their arses up to Manaos to play a football match in sweltering heat in front of 3,000 people.

[thirtyyarder]

A legal dispute means that the CBF (the Brazilian FA) is considering dissolving the championship and reforming it as a knockout competition so as to avoid the problems in having to make a decision regarding a legal dispute. Tim Vickery sums it up much better than I could:

http://espnfc.com/blog/_/name/futebolbr ... 49?cc=3888

What he neglects to mention is that the biggest club in Brazil, Flamengo, had also fielded an illegible player the day before. If they had been punished as Portuguesa was punished, they would have been relegated, the theory goes that they paid Portuguesa to take the relegation for them. Let me just add that Flamengo has never been relegated and is universally hated throughout Brazil.

[Sanguine]

It's been revealed that 70% of Neymar's transfer fee from Santos to Barcelona went to his 'right's owners', specifically, his parents.

[Mr Angry]

Whilst in no way saying that something dodgy hasn't happened, it seems to be a truism that before every major World sporting event there are always stories circulating of something amiss, whether its corrupt officials, stadiums not going to be ready, a terrorist threat or how the local police will deal with any hooligans (cue pictures of riot police with dogs and water cannons steaming into mocked up "hoolies" who all seem to be wearing England shirts.....); even the Olympics here had a dose (security threat due to G4S screwing up; terrorist threat which needed a couple of Typhoons stationed at Northolt and a destroyer in the Thames Basin; traffic congestion etc etc)

Its all part and parcel of what fills todays 24 hour "news" culture.

[thirtyyarder]

So sorry, didn't realize there was already an existing thread.

I feel that I must try and clear the name of my second team fluminense. There have have been various scandals involving irregular players and match fixing, however not a single scandal has involved flu directly, it just so happens that we always seem to benefit indirectly. In the case of us jumping from the third to the first, this came about as there was a similar situation involving an irregular player in a game, not fielded by flu as we were in the third division at the time, the subsequent loss of points meant that botafogo escaped relegation at the expense of a small team. The small team took the CBF to court, the CBF reacted by dissolving the championship and reforming it with the teams that could, would and should have been relegated. They also invited the glamorous teams that weren't in the first division at the time, as well as not inviting the smaller teams that were in the first division at the time. The lawsuit that the smaller team, gama is their name, raised against the CBF is still in the courts until today, with no precision of being heard.

To sum up, if you thought our football was a mess...

[Pepe the Horseman]

Why are Fluminese your second team?

[stealthpapes]

I remember reading that Brazil basically runs two, parallel, pyramids.

The biggest teams play in both, so national and state, the smaller ones only in the state. I went cross-eyed.

[Barry the bird boggler]

Generally isn't the football season in Brazil 12 months long, they have the national competitions, then local plus all the copa liberatodores stuff as well so many players are relieved to get transferred abroad.

[soggy biscuit]

the biggest club in Brazil, Flamengo

Flamengo is universally hated throughout Brazil.

lolwut!

Do you mean in a Man Utd way i.e actually the most liked but it makes you feel good to claim the opposite?

[Barry the bird boggler]

I was thinking in the more usual Man Utd way, hate them and don't try and hide it.

[Platypuss]

It is, of course, quite possible to be legitimately both the most hated and the most liked club at the same time.

[From Despair To Where?]

Generally isn't the football season in Brazil 12 months long, they have the national competitions, then local plus all the copa liberatodores stuff as well so many players are relieved to get transferred abroad.

I just assumed the bigger clubs played reserve sides against the smaller clubs in the State championships

[Brum Royal]

I was under the impression that relegation issues were decided over a points average over a six "season" (in fact a 3 month) period, and not in the normal way.

It certainly is complicated though

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Brazilian_football_league_system

[thirtyyarder]

Why are Fluminese your second team?

Lived in rio for the last six years.

[thirtyyarder]

the biggest club in Brazil, Flamengo

Flamengo is universally hated throughout Brazil.

lolwut!

Do you mean in a Man Utd way i.e actually the most liked but it makes you feel good to claim the opposite?

I could equate it to man utd in the 90s, the difference being, for me at least, Man utd always tried to play football in the right way. It's generally the supporters that causes everyone to hate Flamengo, they do have the biggest support here, and the fans believe that it gives them the right to ignore the Chelsea level lack of class that the players, officials, and anyone connected with the club show. Add to that the supporters being pretty violent plus all the corruption scandals that have followed them throughout their history, it is pretty easy to detest the scum.